Would you go back to ICE ?

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RichR
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Post by RichR » Sun Feb 06, 2022 10:56 am

When there’s an affordable replacement for our 15 year old VW Caravelle (2.5 TDI) it’ll go. Perhaps in 5 years maybe a second hand ID.Buzz?

I got over my desire for fast cars in my 30s, and capable off-roaders after that. Now it’s all about comfort and practicality. Getting four dogs and four people 500 miles to a dog show and back will obviously require a bit of planning with current EVs, but it’s very possible.
Enyaq iV 80 Sportline, Energy Blue, Assisted Drive Plus, Infotainment Plus, Convenience Plus, Comfort Seat Plus, Transport Pack, Heat Pump, 125kW charging, Built Nov 2021.

Goaty
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Post by Goaty » Mon Feb 07, 2022 8:41 am

I drove an almost new automatic diesel Seat Terracco (or whatever it’s called) recently when my Enyaq was in for repair. It was a bit larger than the Enyaq - maybe Seat’s ‘Kodiaq’ equivalent?

It was a good opportunity for me to compare a modern diesel, since getting the Enyaq in November; our knackered Qashqai doesn’t really qualify in this respect!

Drive wise and comfort wise - pretty similar experience, including the Lane Assist stuff. It was obviously noisier, but did seem to warm up far quicker than our Qashqai or the BMW I used to have. Almost as quickly as the Enyaq. Therefore there’s not really much difference in ‘driving’ experience (imo) so there’s still room for me to be interested in new ICE cars.

My reason for considering an EV in the first place was, to be honest, for purely selfish reasons. This time last year, I’d never even heard of the Enyaq. It was our greatly watered-down company car list - with absolutely nothing on it that I’d be prepared to pay ~£5k a year BiK tax for - which had me looking into the EV options; by comparison, the Enyaq only costs me about £200 annually instead of 5 grand! Very quickly came to the conclusion that an EV would be a no-brainer.

However if the tax situation becomes less favourable for company car drivers, and if the cost-per-mile edges closer to ICE rates, then I would consider going back to ICE.
I’m a ‘spreadsheet’ person and if I discover that the cost difference (to me personally) between running a company EV and a company ICE car falls below £1000 / year, then I’ll be swapping back. Don’t get me wrong - I really enjoy driving my Enyaq, but I’m only prepared to sacrifice the convenience of forecourt fill-ups, if there’s a significant financial justification; which is the case at the moment but I’m all too aware Rishi Sunak has the likes of me on his radar!
iV80 Loft, ordered 25/5/21, del: 4/11/21. Black, 21” Betria, 125kW, Climate +, Asst Drive Basic. (company car, replaced BMW 520d). Tethered PodPoint.

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RichR
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Post by RichR » Mon Feb 07, 2022 9:55 am

I think for many people who have the ability to charge at home and drive less than 200 miles a day, the idea of having to take your car to a special shop every so often to fill a tank with smelly oil will sound a bit quaint in 10 years' time. Like having to take your lead acid radio batteries to a chemist to get them swapped for charged ones as many people did until the 1940s. :)
Enyaq iV 80 Sportline, Energy Blue, Assisted Drive Plus, Infotainment Plus, Convenience Plus, Comfort Seat Plus, Transport Pack, Heat Pump, 125kW charging, Built Nov 2021.

Goaty
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Post by Goaty » Mon Feb 07, 2022 10:08 am

RichR wrote:
Mon Feb 07, 2022 9:55 am
…the idea of having to take your car to a special shop every so often to fill a tank with smelly oil will sound a bit quaint in 10 years' time.

Now that’s just reminded me of the time when a pump failed to stop properly and indeed covered my arm, trouser leg and shoe in ‘smelly oil’ 😩!! I was already a bit late for a meeting but decided to dash back home and change, making me even later! I’d forgotten about that!
iV80 Loft, ordered 25/5/21, del: 4/11/21. Black, 21” Betria, 125kW, Climate +, Asst Drive Basic. (company car, replaced BMW 520d). Tethered PodPoint.

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gap998
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Post by gap998 » Mon Feb 07, 2022 10:13 am

Rowly wrote:
Sun Feb 06, 2022 10:32 am
I dont intend to go back to an ICE car but I spend a lot of my free time riding around on classic Lambretta scooters (I own 4) so my Enyaq will ease my conscience about the clouds of 2-stoke fumes I leave in my wake ! ;) :oops:
Something for the future? :D
https://www.vespa.com/en_EN/models/elettrica/
Skoda Enyaq iV60 Loft 100kW Charging, Arctic Silver, Regulus 19", Heat Pump, Assisted Drive Pack, Parking Pack +, Drive Sport Pack, Convenience Pack+, Transport Pack

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metalmadhammer
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Post by metalmadhammer » Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:04 am

ChangoMutney wrote:
Sat Feb 05, 2022 10:39 pm
metalmadhammer wrote:
Sat Feb 05, 2022 10:55 am
Them bloody windmills are not the answer - wish they would stop messing about with useless renewables and increase our nuclear capability - This will be the only way we can all enjoy EV's when the ICE cars are barred.
Fact check - those bloody windmills definitely are at least part of the answer. Its now the cheapest way to generate electricity. Current Nuclear technology is only a short to medium term solution, and getting rid of nuclear waste is a significant problem we really haven't solved yet.
The windmills are completely useless when the wind doesn't blow (On average it doesn't blow enough to turn the windmills for 7 weeks of the year - FACT and in some cases up to 11 days in a row). The amount of waste made by modern small Molten Salt Reactors is insignificant (The Chinese want to send the waste back to the sun in rockets as a typical large Nuclear power station only produces 1 cubic Meter of waste per year but i'm not sure that's a good idea) as is the risk of a any breach of the reactor.
Whatever the method, we need a method of generation which can meet demand any hour of any day of the year, not just when the wind blows and/or the sun shines, the only renewable method of any real use is hydro. If instantaneous power generation isn't achieved, we face a future of energy lockdowns which is just planning to fail IMO.
Enyaq 80 Suite, Race Blue, Panoramic Sunroof, 20" Vega Alloys and a silly overpriced rubber mat for the boot.

Goaty
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Post by Goaty » Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:19 am

/\ Just to chime in a little here though - renewable energy (from wind, solar etc) is stored in BESS systems (Battery Energy Storage) so it can be brought online when required. The wind doesn’t actually need to be blowing at the time when demand is there.
Like our EV’s, BESS systems largely use Lithium-Ion technology for storage (and include all the debate around ethical sourcing of raw materials, how to prevent thermal runaway fires from developing, etc).

I felt it was relevant to make this point although I’ve no idea how long BESS systems can ‘keep the lights on’ if there’s a period of lower ‘input’ from less windy days etc. Solar panels still provide energy for storage, even on cloudy days.

From one of the industries I’ve been involved with, I know there is a 30~40% increase year on year in the BESS market. They are absolutely ‘going for it’.
iV80 Loft, ordered 25/5/21, del: 4/11/21. Black, 21” Betria, 125kW, Climate +, Asst Drive Basic. (company car, replaced BMW 520d). Tethered PodPoint.

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RichR
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Post by RichR » Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:42 am

I've been working in the electricity generation industry for some time, and currently work for a very large power station that also has several hydro and pumped storage sites. The future is probably going to be a mix of wind, wave and solar providing a lot of power when conditions are suitable, backed up with pumped hydro or other storage systems such as hydrogen generation and combustion, and a few large nuclear and other steam turbine based units. To keep the grid stable requires a certain amount of 'inertia' - which was always traditionally coal and nuclear. Now most of the coal generation is gone, it falls to biomass and the larger CCGT gas generation to fill that gap. Biomass (especially when using waste from the timber or farming sectors) is a good technology, but it's not suitable to take up all the capacity coal provided. The number of CCGT gas units will probably stay about the same for a decade, and then they'll begin to be replaced (or converted to hydrogen perhaps).

Using excess electricity from wind and solar to split seawater to produce hydrogen is very much something that many countries are working on. It can be stored relatively easily and burned similar to natural gas, so it's a good way to transition away from gas as well as provide a way to deal with the irregular production of wind and solar. Using that excess and storage systems is the way most of the world is going, as it's a sustainable way of doing things and also ultimately has lower running costs due to not needing to get fuels.

Coal, gas and oil do need to be phased out, and we have the ability to replace them with enough wind, solar, wave, tidal, hydro and biomass to provide the base generation, with storage generation using hydro pumped, subsea pressure, hydrogen, even battery (though that doesn't scale well at national grid levels) to bring the stability. However things don't move quickly when you're building things on this scale. 20 years for a new project is not an unusual timeline. We'll be off coal in a few months (only one grid connected commercial coal power station in the UK at the moment, with a couple of semi-mothballed units coming online occasionally when National Grid demand it). Similarly carbon capture and storage plant is now beginning to be constructed and put into use, it's not just a 'at some point' technology. But it'll take a few years to get all the construction completed before it starts to come online.

It's all very possible, and the generation and distribution industry has been working on the prospect of a shift to electric vehicles for over 40 years. It's not something that has suddenly crept up and people are rushing to provide a solution to now. What we do have now though is a range of solutions, and different countries can choose use what works best for them.
Enyaq iV 80 Sportline, Energy Blue, Assisted Drive Plus, Infotainment Plus, Convenience Plus, Comfort Seat Plus, Transport Pack, Heat Pump, 125kW charging, Built Nov 2021.

Goaty
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Post by Goaty » Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:57 am

/\ did you just write that ‘article worthy’ content in the last half hour, or grabbed it from somewhere else? Very impressive if you did! 👍. You could be a journalist!
iV80 Loft, ordered 25/5/21, del: 4/11/21. Black, 21” Betria, 125kW, Climate +, Asst Drive Basic. (company car, replaced BMW 520d). Tethered PodPoint.

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RichR
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Post by RichR » Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:27 pm

I started writing it before your post, then finished it after ;)

It's something the company I work for keeps us well informed about, as it's of interest to most employees. The previous company I worked for offloaded all its gas and oil generation and just kept solar, wind and two large pumped hydro (in North Wales if you want to guess which!). Where I am now also offloaded everything not renewable last year, leaving just biomass and hydro (pumped, dam and river hydro all in Scotland). And those aren't the only two UK electricity generators doing that. Most of the gas and oil assets are now owned by smaller companies rather than the major generators. Fossil fuels are definitely on their way out in the UK and Western Europe, with wind, wave and solar replacing them rapidly.
Enyaq iV 80 Sportline, Energy Blue, Assisted Drive Plus, Infotainment Plus, Convenience Plus, Comfort Seat Plus, Transport Pack, Heat Pump, 125kW charging, Built Nov 2021.

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